{"language": "en", "segments": [{"text": " Well here we are at the famous computer cafe with our guest Jim Zuber.", "start": 0.0, "stop": 3.5, "id": 0}, {"text": " First of all welcome to the cafe.", "start": 3.98, "stop": 5.3, "id": 1}, {"text": " Thank you very much Michael.", "start": 5.64, "stop": 6.42, "id": 2}, {"text": " Um, tell us a little bit about yourself. I know you, uh, I know you pretty well,", "start": 7.06, "stop": 11.62, "id": 3}, {"text": " but I know many of our listeners don't know who you are, even though they've", "start": 11.62, "stop": 14.84, "id": 4}, {"text": " probably seen some of your software, even if they haven't.", "start": 14.84, "stop": 17.2, "id": 5}, {"text": " Well, um, I guess the best place to start is I'm kind of a dyed in the wool", "start": 17.62, "stop": 21.0, "id": 6}, {"text": " computer hobbyist, got into this thing around 1975, bought one of the first Kim", "start": 21.0, "stop": 25.5, "id": 7}, {"text": " One microcomputers from the old MOS technology that Commodore eventually bought.", "start": 25.5, "stop": 29.7, "id": 8}, {"text": " Started one of the first microcomputer clubs in the Los Angeles area called the", "start": 30.46, "stop": 33.62, "id": 9}, {"text": " 6502 users groups and wrote articles and kind of got into the whole computer", "start": 33.62, "stop": 38.08, "id": 10}, {"text": " hobbyist scene about the time the Apple and Commodore were introduced.", "start": 38.08, "stop": 40.88, "id": 11}, {"text": " Um, pursued my corporate career, which wasn't in", "start": 41.44, "stop": 44.0, "id": 12}, {"text": " computers, was for a large printer manufacturer.", "start": 44.0, "stop": 46.04, "id": 13}, {"text": " And about three years ago, after making a little bit of money in the stock", "start": 46.72, "stop": 50.2, "id": 14}, {"text": " market, losing about half of it, I decided to write a game for the IBM personal", "start": 50.2, "stop": 54.96, "id": 15}, {"text": " computer that kind of modeled my experiences in the stock market and I kind of", "start": 54.96, "stop": 59.12, "id": 16}, {"text": " hoped would prevent other people from making the stupid mistakes that I made.", "start": 59.12, "stop": 62.18, "id": 17}, {"text": " And that was the, that was millionaire.", "start": 62.38, "stop": 63.9, "id": 18}, {"text": " And, uh, since then we wrote tycoon, the commodity market simulation, Baron, the", "start": 64.56, "stop": 68.88, "id": 19}, {"text": " real estate simulation, and our latest product Squire", "start": 68.88, "stop": 71.52, "id": 20}, {"text": " is a financial planning simulation.", "start": 71.52, "stop": 73.36, "id": 21}, {"text": " You know, interestingly enough, a lot of people, I've been talking with some", "start": 73.42, "stop": 77.02, "id": 22}, {"text": " folks who, who really feel that software is a way in which to help create within", "start": 77.02, "stop": 81.5, "id": 23}, {"text": " an individual's mind, uh, uh, an order, so to speak, of how", "start": 81.5, "stop": 85.56, "id": 24}, {"text": " to go about doing certain things.", "start": 85.56, "stop": 87.08, "id": 25}, {"text": " For instance, let's take millionaire.", "start": 87.2, "stop": 88.78, "id": 26}, {"text": " It gives you, what, 15 different stocks in five industries, right?", "start": 89.06, "stop": 92.76, "id": 27}, {"text": " That's right. 15 stocks in five industry groups.", "start": 92.92, "stop": 95.18, "id": 28}, {"text": " And basically what the game allows you to do is to experience, through a computer", "start": 95.36, "stop": 98.78, "id": 29}, {"text": " simulation, something that would cost you thousands of dollars in many, many", "start": 98.78, "stop": 102.64, "id": 30}, {"text": " months or perhaps years, uh, to learn.", "start": 102.64, "stop": 105.86, "id": 31}, {"text": " And it's kind of what we refer to it as learning the market fundamentals.", "start": 106.3, "stop": 109.44, "id": 32}, {"text": " You learn the essence of the marketplace so that you don't make stupid mistakes.", "start": 109.44, "stop": 113.42, "id": 33}, {"text": " And the computer, to be honest with you, is by far the", "start": 113.88, "stop": 116.66, "id": 34}, {"text": " best vehicle to convey those lessons.", "start": 116.66, "stop": 118.34, "id": 35}, {"text": " One of the neatest things about getting exposed to the millionaire in any of your", "start": 118.62, "stop": 122.82, "id": 36}, {"text": " games, let's say you have millionaire, tycoon, Baron, and, and your newest one", "start": 122.82, "stop": 126.7, "id": 37}, {"text": " Squire, which gives you all of the different things that you can do.", "start": 126.7, "stop": 129.68, "id": 38}, {"text": " It's like a real-time financial, uh, game.", "start": 129.74, "stop": 132.22, "id": 39}, {"text": " But, but the interesting thing that I found is that I, I didn't", "start": 132.42, "stop": 134.96, "id": 40}, {"text": " have to know how to use a computer.", "start": 134.96, "stop": 136.46, "id": 41}, {"text": " I mean, I push this button and push a couple buttons, but it's really", "start": 136.46, "stop": 140.12, "id": 42}, {"text": " about engaging in the game.", "start": 140.12, "stop": 141.62, "id": 43}, {"text": " That's right. I think our, uh, I think the best analogy that I've heard is that,", "start": 142.14, "stop": 145.98, "id": 44}, {"text": " and our, our company president, Bob Slifen, uses this, is that, um, it's a game", "start": 145.98, "stop": 150.74, "id": 45}, {"text": " that happens to use the rules of the real world.", "start": 150.74, "stop": 154.12, "id": 46}, {"text": " Okay. It's, it's this, you know, it's a stock market game.", "start": 154.28, "stop": 156.58, "id": 47}, {"text": " You, you sit down and you, it's as easy to play as Pac-Man.", "start": 156.72, "stop": 159.06, "id": 48}, {"text": " But, the reality of the situation is that the rules that are used to govern the", "start": 159.32, "stop": 163.76, "id": 49}, {"text": " game are the rules of the real world.", "start": 163.76, "stop": 165.3, "id": 50}, {"text": " And when you get done playing the game and you've had your thrill and you've had", "start": 165.3, "stop": 168.34, "id": 51}, {"text": " your fun, you've learned something about the real world and you're a better", "start": 168.34, "stop": 171.76, "id": 52}, {"text": " investor, a more informed individual as a whole.", "start": 171.76, "stop": 174.7, "id": 53}, {"text": " It gives you a better sense. We're gonna take a call. Hi, you're on the line.", "start": 175.2, "stop": 178.54, "id": 54}, {"text": " Hello.", "start": 179.8, "stop": 180.14, "id": 55}, {"text": " Hello.", "start": 180.42, "stop": 180.7, "id": 56}, {"text": " Um, no, he wants to...", "start": 181.16, "stop": 182.98, "id": 57}, {"text": " Oh, okay. I guess it's not for us. Listen, I'll tell you something.", "start": 182.98, "stop": 186.6, "id": 58}, {"text": " The interesting thing that I found about, uh, with the Squire game is that when", "start": 187.04, "stop": 191.22, "id": 59}, {"text": " you, you take only a few stock companies and you take a few real estate options", "start": 191.22, "stop": 197.3, "id": 60}, {"text": " and you do all kinds of things together in that one, it's not like just", "start": 197.3, "stop": 201.24, "id": 61}, {"text": " with one area that's the piece.", "start": 201.24, "stop": 202.86, "id": 62}, {"text": " I think the hardest thing we found with Squire, obviously, with Millionaire", "start": 203.02, "stop": 206.06, "id": 63}, {"text": " focusing on just the stock market and by coming in the commodity market and", "start": 206.06, "stop": 209.4, "id": 64}, {"text": " bearing the real estate market, we were able to develop a game that looked at the", "start": 209.4, "stop": 213.26, "id": 65}, {"text": " specific mechanisms for each of those markets.", "start": 213.26, "stop": 215.46, "id": 66}, {"text": " The challenge in Squire was to take everything from the real estate market,", "start": 215.46, "stop": 219.8, "id": 67}, {"text": " commodities, bonds, collectibles, uh, Ira's, money market accounts and try to", "start": 220.02, "stop": 224.84, "id": 68}, {"text": " find some common thread through all of them that would convey a financial lesson.", "start": 224.84, "stop": 229.76, "id": 69}, {"text": " And the common thread that we found that ran through all of these various", "start": 229.9, "stop": 233.14, "id": 70}, {"text": " investment vehicles was the degree of risk associated", "start": 233.14, "stop": 237.08, "id": 71}, {"text": " with each individual investment.", "start": 237.08, "stop": 238.76, "id": 72}, {"text": " And so what the game shows you very, very clearly as you sit down to play it is", "start": 239.18, "stop": 243.18, "id": 73}, {"text": " that if you put your money in the commodity market six months before you're gonna", "start": 243.18, "stop": 246.92, "id": 74}, {"text": " retire, that gee, that isn't so smart.", "start": 246.92, "stop": 248.62, "id": 75}, {"text": " If you put your money in bonds and interest rates drop, it's just all the", "start": 248.92, "stop": 252.0, "id": 76}, {"text": " interrelationships between the investments is what's unique about Squire, not", "start": 252.0, "stop": 256.26, "id": 77}, {"text": " just the fact that you can learn about the stock market, but you can learn about", "start": 256.26, "stop": 259.76, "id": 78}, {"text": " whether the stock market's a better investment than perhaps real estate.", "start": 259.76, "stop": 262.8, "id": 79}, {"text": " A basic scenario. I'm 35 years old and I'm thinking of retiring at age", "start": 262.98, "stop": 267.98, "id": 80}, {"text": " 58, okay?", "start": 267.98, "stop": 270.0, "id": 81}, {"text": " And, um, okay, so I have those years, about 23 years, yeah, no, 28 years almost", "start": 270.0, "stop": 276.98, "id": 82}, {"text": " or so, that I have to, um, retire in. Well, I might want to buy a house, right?", "start": 276.98, "stop": 283.54, "id": 83}, {"text": " But then I have some extra dollars, so I might want to also keep my money in a", "start": 283.88, "stop": 287.38, "id": 84}, {"text": " money market fund where I can work with the greatest amount of interest rate.", "start": 287.38, "stop": 290.88, "id": 85}, {"text": " Right. I think that what Squire allows you to do that's really unique is we have", "start": 291.06, "stop": 294.86, "id": 86}, {"text": " something called the reality mode that allows you, when you sit down to play the", "start": 294.86, "stop": 298.78, "id": 87}, {"text": " game, to put in what kind of lifestyle you'd like to maintain when you retire.", "start": 298.78, "stop": 302.86, "id": 88}, {"text": " What all of your interim goals, sending your kids to school and buying a house,", "start": 303.24, "stop": 306.48, "id": 89}, {"text": " and then what the game does is it converts all of that information into assets in", "start": 306.76, "stop": 312.1, "id": 90}, {"text": " the game. If you say you have $10,000 for the stock today, when you start playing", "start": 312.1, "stop": 316.52, "id": 91}, {"text": " Squire, you actually have $10,000 for the stock to work with.", "start": 316.52, "stop": 319.88, "id": 92}, {"text": " Wow, so then as you get moving on it, as you build... ...proper investments", "start": 320.06, "stop": 327.0, "id": 93}, {"text": " and you don't have enough money to send your kids to college, it teaches you how", "start": 327.0, "stop": 331.16, "id": 94}, {"text": " to prepare for these unexpected interim type goals and you can play the game", "start": 331.16, "stop": 335.56, "id": 95}, {"text": " many, many different times with different strategies.", "start": 335.56, "stop": 337.68, "id": 96}, {"text": " That's incredible. The folks in LA, 628 KIEV, San Fernando Valley, 989 KIEV,", "start": 337.78, "stop": 344.52, "id": 97}, {"text": " South Bay, 835 KIEV, give us a call. Talk", "start": 344.8, "stop": 348.02, "id": 98}, {"text": " with Jim. We'll be right back in a moment.", "start": 348.02, "stop": 349.6, "id": 99}, {"text": " Supercalc 3 by Sorsom is a spreadsheet that's extremely easy to use, swift and", "start": 355.79999999999995, "stop": 360.5, "id": 100}, {"text": " powerful, and it's priced lower than most other leading spreadsheet programs.", "start": 360.5, "stop": 364.48, "id": 101}, {"text": " Supercalc 3 has all the built-in functions expected in a high quality", "start": 365.46, "stop": 368.86, "id": 102}, {"text": " spreadsheet and a lot more.", "start": 368.86, "stop": 370.58, "id": 103}, {"text": " Supercalc 3's features include an on-screen help function, spreadsheet", "start": 370.58, "stop": 375.28, "id": 104}, {"text": " consolidation and sorting capabilities, calendar and date calculations, simple", "start": 375.28, "stop": 380.02, "id": 105}, {"text": " data management, functions and windowing.", "start": 380.02, "stop": 382.38, "id": 106}, {"text": " The integrated graphics capability is superbly presented, allowing plotting and", "start": 382.78, "stop": 387.26, "id": 107}, {"text": " printing of charts in up to 99 colors.", "start": 387.26, "stop": 389.4, "id": 108}, {"text": " Supercalc 3 provides you with the ability to create pie charts, bar charts, line", "start": 390.26, "stop": 394.5, "id": 109}, {"text": " charts and XY graphs.", "start": 394.5, "stop": 396.02, "id": 110}, {"text": " The graphics are integrated into the command structure, so once you learn", "start": 396.02, "stop": 400.34, "id": 111}, {"text": " Supercalc 3, plotting and graphing the results of your", "start": 400.34, "stop": 403.0, "id": 112}, {"text": " calculations is as easy as pie.", "start": 403.0, "stop": 404.88, "id": 113}, {"text": " To get a taste of the simplicity and power of Supercalc 3, rock into Simply", "start": 405.7, "stop": 409.92, "id": 114}, {"text": " Software, where they'd love to whip up a quick demonstration.", "start": 409.92, "stop": 412.7, "id": 115}, {"text": " Simply Software is located at 3001 Sepulveda Boulevard in Manhattan Beach, or", "start": 412.7, "stop": 418.72, "id": 116}, {"text": " call 213-546-2467. That's 213-546", "start": 418.72, "stop": 424.28, "id": 117}, {"text": "-2467. Simply Software, a soft sell dealer.", "start": 424.28, "stop": 428.78, "id": 118}, {"text": " You know, it's kind of interesting. You guys are of that breed of companies that", "start": 431.26, "stop": 436.52, "id": 119}, {"text": " started out in the garage. You know how they talk about those young", "start": 436.52, "stop": 439.18, "id": 120}, {"text": " entrepreneurial companies who start out in the garage and", "start": 439.18, "stop": 442.32, "id": 121}, {"text": " become overnight successes.", "start": 442.32, "stop": 443.94, "id": 122}, {"text": " Give me a bit of sense about that.", "start": 444.5, "stop": 446.34, "id": 123}, {"text": " I think the funniest thing I can relate, I guess, is our first meeting where you", "start": 446.34, "stop": 451.12, "id": 124}, {"text": " bought Millionaire and you had a little bit of trouble with it.", "start": 451.12, "stop": 453.16, "id": 125}, {"text": " You called up my partner's garage, Fobben Eileen Slapen, and they said, gee,", "start": 453.28, "stop": 458.92, "id": 126}, {"text": " you'll have to call our customer support over in Jim's garage.", "start": 458.96, "stop": 461.96, "id": 127}, {"text": " And we kind of jokingly called ourselves the two garage operation, and that's a", "start": 462.34, "stop": 465.72, "id": 128}, {"text": " lot different than the 5,000 square foot of manufacturing space and 20 people.", "start": 465.72, "stop": 470.26, "id": 129}, {"text": " We're a real live business now, and I think our growth kind of parallels the", "start": 471.2, "stop": 475.56, "id": 130}, {"text": " growth of the microcomputer industry as a whole.", "start": 475.56, "stop": 477.5, "id": 131}, {"text": " You know, the interesting thing that I'll point out here is that we've been doing", "start": 477.88, "stop": 481.24, "id": 132}, {"text": " a lot of shows, and we travel to different shows like CES and Condex and a lot", "start": 481.24, "stop": 486.0, "id": 133}, {"text": " of different places, and we've been doing them.", "start": 486.0, "stop": 487.6, "id": 134}, {"text": " That's really how we get a lot of these new guests here.", "start": 487.68, "stop": 489.9, "id": 135}, {"text": " But this overnight success stuff, starting from a small garage operation, doesn't", "start": 490.48, "stop": 495.16, "id": 136}, {"text": " just happen. You really got to work hard at it.", "start": 495.16, "stop": 497.94, "id": 137}, {"text": " And you guys have been really doing an excellent job. I always see you around,", "start": 497.94, "stop": 503.14, "id": 138}, {"text": " and people are really impressed with your product.", "start": 503.3, "stop": 505.5, "id": 139}, {"text": " The interesting thing that I'm curious about is when you get feedback from people", "start": 506.22, "stop": 511.46, "id": 140}, {"text": " about your games. What kind of things come up?", "start": 511.46, "stop": 513.8, "id": 141}, {"text": " I think the two most, a couple of little comments that we get, one will be, gee,", "start": 513.8, "stop": 520.0, "id": 142}, {"text": " I bought your real estate game, Baron, and I've been trying to explain to my wife", "start": 520.08, "stop": 523.56, "id": 143}, {"text": " what I've been doing for 10 years.", "start": 523.56, "stop": 525.26, "id": 144}, {"text": " She sat down and played Baron, and in 10 minutes now understands what I do from a", "start": 525.26, "stop": 529.28, "id": 145}, {"text": " living. And we get that from spouses, both male and female, for all sorts of", "start": 529.28, "stop": 533.4, "id": 146}, {"text": " stockbrokers and commodity brokers.", "start": 533.4, "stop": 535.08, "id": 147}, {"text": " We'll get a call from somebody that says, my God, all the money I didn't lose", "start": 535.42, "stop": 538.48, "id": 148}, {"text": " from stupid mistakes by playing your game.", "start": 538.48, "stop": 540.54, "id": 149}, {"text": " I mean, how many businesses can you be in where people thank you for selling them", "start": 540.9, "stop": 545.42, "id": 150}, {"text": " the product and say, you know, you're doing something really socially", "start": 545.42, "stop": 548.04, "id": 151}, {"text": " redeeming, and that's a fun thing to do.", "start": 548.04, "stop": 549.98, "id": 152}, {"text": " I guess the incredible thing about any, you know, I used to sell securities, and", "start": 549.98, "stop": 553.88, "id": 153}, {"text": " one of the interesting things about that business is that is one", "start": 553.88, "stop": 557.76, "id": 154}, {"text": " of the most asked questions.", "start": 557.76, "stop": 559.42, "id": 155}, {"text": " What do I do with my money? I guess everybody's in the business of wherever", "start": 559.64, "stop": 563.92, "id": 156}, {"text": " they're at working hard. They make this thing called", "start": 563.92, "stop": 567.06, "id": 157}, {"text": " money. Now what do they do with it?", "start": 567.06, "stop": 568.72, "id": 158}, {"text": " The neat thing about the games is that people then can begin to practice. If I", "start": 568.72, "stop": 573.66, "id": 159}, {"text": " was really going to do it, what would happen if over the next 20 years I actually", "start": 573.66, "stop": 577.52, "id": 160}, {"text": " put $2,000 in my IRA?", "start": 577.52, "stop": 579.52, "id": 161}, {"text": " What would the effects of compound interest actually look like on that?", "start": 580.16, "stop": 583.2, "id": 162}, {"text": " Right. I think the thing I always say is that really it takes three things to", "start": 583.2, "stop": 587.42, "id": 163}, {"text": " invest money. Obviously, you need the time to properly research things.", "start": 587.42, "stop": 591.96, "id": 164}, {"text": " You just need that little kernel of knowledge, that fundamental market knowledge,", "start": 591.96, "stop": 595.08, "id": 165}, {"text": " and you also need a proper sense of timing when to buy and when to sell.", "start": 595.44, "stop": 599.18, "id": 166}, {"text": " And the things that our games can provide you are the fundamental market", "start": 599.34, "stop": 603.02, "id": 167}, {"text": " knowledge and a little bit of practice on the timing issue.", "start": 603.02, "stop": 605.54, "id": 168}, {"text": " It can't make you rich quick, but boy, I'll tell you, it can save you some awful", "start": 606.18, "stop": 609.62, "id": 169}, {"text": " big, awful expensive mistakes.", "start": 609.62, "stop": 611.34, "id": 170}, {"text": " How many of us have gone out there and actually wanted to do something and", "start": 611.54, "stop": 615.48, "id": 171}, {"text": " realized that it's the experience of having done it that makes you feel", "start": 615.48, "stop": 618.74, "id": 172}, {"text": " more comfortable in a new environment?", "start": 618.74, "stop": 620.4, "id": 173}, {"text": " We're going to take a call. Hi, you're on the line.", "start": 620.4, "stop": 623.1, "id": 174}, {"text": " Hi, I'm Aiden. My money is stock market last November. I spent it on a trip to", "start": 623.66, "stop": 629.14, "id": 175}, {"text": " the Orient. But basically the reason I called is I had an IBM PC and well, I'm", "start": 629.14, "stop": 636.12, "id": 176}, {"text": " forced to sell it, paid for my trip, and I wanted to know how fast, you know, the", "start": 636.12, "stop": 640.9, "id": 177}, {"text": " changing technology is.", "start": 640.9, "stop": 644.4, "id": 178}, {"text": " What do you think we might see one, two years from now?", "start": 645.02, "stop": 648.14, "id": 179}, {"text": " Well, as a software developer, we're always grappling with what the latest", "start": 648.14, "stop": 652.54, "id": 180}, {"text": " and greatest technology is going to be.", "start": 652.54, "stop": 654.16, "id": 181}, {"text": " And to be frank with you, the thing that we do is we try to write our games in", "start": 654.26, "stop": 657.86, "id": 182}, {"text": " languages and using tools that are independent of the", "start": 657.86, "stop": 661.44, "id": 183}, {"text": " hardware technology changes.", "start": 661.44, "stop": 663.42, "id": 184}, {"text": " Currently, our software runs on the IBM, the Apple II, the", "start": 663.94, "stop": 667.18, "id": 185}, {"text": " Macintosh, and the Commodore 64.", "start": 667.18, "stop": 669.28, "id": 186}, {"text": " And we're ready and prepared to put our products up on", "start": 670.08, "stop": 672.7, "id": 187}, {"text": " any machine that comes down the road.", "start": 672.7, "stop": 674.38, "id": 188}, {"text": " To be quite frank with you, sir, I think the IBM is a good machine.", "start": 675.1399999999999, "stop": 679.84, "id": 189}, {"text": " And I think if you're going to get rid of your IBM in hopes of buying something", "start": 680.38, "stop": 683.96, "id": 190}, {"text": " greater and spiffier down the road, you're making a mistake.", "start": 683.96, "stop": 687.4, "id": 191}, {"text": " No, actually, I'm only at because one of the reasons that money factor is that I", "start": 688.44, "stop": 694.46, "id": 192}, {"text": " just found the IBM programs are so expensive.", "start": 694.46, "stop": 697.1, "id": 193}, {"text": " Well, I think there's a general generally downward trend in pricing in general.", "start": 697.88, "stop": 704.58, "id": 194}, {"text": " But I think that if you look at products such as ours, the value that you get for", "start": 704.7, "stop": 708.2, "id": 195}, {"text": " the money is really what you ought to be looking at,", "start": 708.2, "stop": 709.86, "id": 196}, {"text": " not the absolute price of the software.", "start": 709.88, "stop": 711.54, "id": 197}, {"text": " Jim, not that he should be looking and getting rid of his IBM, but do your games", "start": 711.72, "stop": 717.42, "id": 198}, {"text": " run on other computers as well?", "start": 717.42, "stop": 719.3, "id": 199}, {"text": " As I just mentioned, they run on the Commodore 64, the Macintosh, the Apple II,", "start": 719.3, "stop": 724.8, "id": 200}, {"text": " and of course the IBM PC and PC units.", "start": 725.32, "stop": 727.5, "id": 201}]}